So admittedly, I am brand new to both Pure Data and the Organelle, but I am usually really pretty good at figuring things out quickly… but I am stuck, and was wondering who is the person to go to [here?] for a bit of troubleshooting on a patch?
Basically, I was searching for a particular Organelle patch, and was very surprised that no one has made it yet, as I thought it would have been one of the first things attempted (I don’t want to spoil what it is yet, it’s a surprise!) So I found a Pure Data version of what I wanted, and am trying to simply convert it for use on the Organelle. I’ve got almost everything working, except the Knobs are having no affect on the sound as they should (but they are updating the Screen with the proper values) and MIDI notes are not working, but the “sequencer” (not really a sequencer, but it kind of is) is working when the Aux button is pressed.
I guess to start with; the Pure Data patch has 4 horizontal sliders to affect the sound (such as “Cutoff” “Decay” etc.) and I thought it would be a simple matter of replacing each slider with an “r knob1” thru “r knob4” object, plugged into the same places as the sliders were, but it’s not working.
Did you scale the incoming knob values? ‘Receiving’ knob1, knob2… will only output a number between 0-1. You have to scale the knob value to a usable range (by multiplying by 2000 for example).
See page 36 of the manual for more information.
And I think I’ve got it sorted… had the “send” connections coming from the wrong place. There is still a couple of things not working, but it is now in a showable state, so I’ll post a video shortly.
I posted a video of this patch in this new thread here and thought I’d keep this thread up for further troubleshooting; though I’ve got to say, I thought this community would be way more active.
In any case, I’m going to post a couple of more things here in hopes that someone will be able to give me some insight… as I am digging around in Pure Data, I’ve now realized that I can right click on objects to view their Properties, so in the original Pd patch, the Decay slider has a value for the “Output Range” as Lower: 0.9 and Upper: 0.999 so how would I translate that as an Organelle Knob? I am trying all sorts of different combinations of things, but none seem to work. I’ve got the other Knobs working as the original patch’s sliders (all of which had different values.)
The other thing is, I would like to be able to hit the Aux button to engage the “Strummer” and hit it again to turn it off. I’ve been able to do that but, it plays the strumming pattern twice as fast as the original Pure Data patch for some reason, just by using the simple objects [r aux] and [sel 1] and an [r notes] object, all 3 of which is going to a pd latch object I got from another Organelle patch. When I changed that by removing the [r notes] and adding a [bang] and patching that between [sel 1] into both inlets of the pd latch, the Strummer plays at the correct speed, but only engages when I hit the Aux button On and then Off again, then it will engage and never actually turn off.
So, the ideal scenario is to have the Strummer play when the Aux is On and to then play individual MIDI notes when the Strummer/Aux is Off. So far, this isn’t happening. (the original patch did not have a method for playing individual MIDI notes, only to engage the Strummer.)
I’m sorry if these are noob questions but, again, there doesn’t seem to be any tutorials for doing this stuff for the Organelle itself. To have to make 5 to 8 Organelle objects just to do what one native Pure Data object does, is what’s tripping me up here, and if I can just get past these last two hurdles, I’ll be all good… again, any help or guidance is greatly appreciated!
EDIT: Here is an updated video of how it’s working at the moment…
For getting the knob in the correct range you’ll have to scale it. Generally this is knob1 * (Upper - Lower) + Lower. Or in Pd:
[r knob1]
|
[* .099]
|
[+ .9]
For the Aux / latch stuff it is hard to tell what might be wrong without looking at it. You can build a switch with two [spigot] objects to route the notes depending on the Aux button.
Thanks! And funny, I did that code but opposite; I had *.9 then + .099 (my Maths are weak these days.)
I just tried as you suggested, but unfortunately it is not working; it only gives me a value of 0 ms on the Decay, no matter how I turn the knob, and with no sound. Thanks though, still trying to figure it out…
Why not pop the unfinished patch up on patchstorage.com for people to look at? People might be more in a positon to be of help if they can quickly identify problems by looking and testing. It’s the open source way, after all!
Thanks for posting. I haven’t got a chance to try it yet, but one thing I noticed after taking a quick look was this order of operations thing:
Coming out of the [sel 1] you have two patchers. The problem is you don’t know which one fires first (actually it is the one created first, but it is hard to keep track of that). This is why you should use the [trigger] object, or [t] for short. With trigger you create as many outlets as you want and they always fire in right to left order. so [t b b] in this case will give you two bang outlets.
also the [pd latch] is expecting midi style note pairs in the left inlet, not a bang, so I’m not really sure what this will sound like as it is…
Thanks for the input. Previously I wasn’t using a bang, I was using the [r notes] to trigger the strummer (I really don’t even know what a lot of this stuff does) but the only way I could get the strummer to play at the proper speed, like in my second video, is by using the bang and the two outs of the [sel 1]. I don’t know why that is the thing that fixes the strummer speed, but it also unfortunately kills the Aux working properly.
So, up to this point it’s been, proper Aux On/Off but wrong strummer speed, or On/Off not working with proper strummer speed. I finally gave up on it and am hoping someone else can fix it on patchstorage (it’s had 9 downloads so far.)
What is driving the backing track that starts up after you tap latch a couple times? Seems to be quite a different sound coming from that than the sounds from tapping the keys. The sounds are lovely. Nice job so far. I’m no expert in PD, but I’ll be an extra pair of tinkering hands.
That’s the actual strummer. Everything you hear is what the Strummer Patch is supposed to sound like. And it’s supposed to start when I hit the Aux button “On” but I broke that functionality, so now it engages when I hit the Aux button On and then Off again… hitting the keys on the keyboard does nothing other than simply restart the strummer from the beginning. In my previous video, the Aux button was working as it should, but it caused the strummer to play faster than it was suppose to.
What I am hoping, is for someone to fix this patch (and I’m sure it’s a simple fix, I’m just too new to all of this) so when you turn On the Aux, the strummer plays at the correct speed, and when you turn it Off, you can play the keyboard to “pluck” the individual MIDI notes (I got that functionality working, but it completely kills the strummer all together.)
I was hoping somebody with more Pd experience than I would have been able to fix this by now (the patch has had 13 downloads.) I am anxious to get this working properly!
Ok so, after two weeks of being up on Patchstorage, I see lots of downloads, but no fixes? Is anybody actually helping to work on this in the spirit of the Open Source community, or is everyone just enjoying it how it is? Back in my Linux days (late 1990s) people use to fix patches on day one!
I guess the problem is most people here are probably musicians first and foremost - many of us don’t have any expertise in fixing or writing patches. I’ve had quite a lot on recently. I will at some point have a look but given your reference to your ‘linux days’ i doubt I will be able to offer any help you could not manage yourself with some time.
That’s understandable I guess, but you were the one who encouraged me to post on Patchstorage because “It’s the open source way, after all” and I’m pretty sure it’s just a simple fix that more experienced Pure Data/Organelle users can catch; or at least I hoped. My Linux days wasn’t in coding by the way; I ran Linux servers and helped report issues, which would get patched almost immediately by the community… of course, it was a much bigger community than this one, so again, understandable why things would be a little slower here.
But with all these other patches that are coming out for the Organelle, I’m surprised one of those guys can’t take a quick look and go “oh, this needs to go here, fixed!” because I’m pretty sure it’s that simple, and I too just haven’t had time to get back to it myself.
Hey genshi. I’ll try to take a look soon. I appreciate your work, but I think the problem is most people that own an organelle are musicians and not sound people, not delving into the pd side of it. I’m a programmer, but am new to the pure data world, so I’m not that knowledgable, but I’ll try to help.
At a very quick glance, I can see the problem with issue 3.
First of all, the is an [expr] object that helps you with all calculations, so you could do [expr $f1 * 8000 + 100] for knob 4.
Second, you are doing some calculation, then using the [int] object, so you are effectively turning the range into 0 or 1, if you remove the [i] object, it should have a better range.
If you want the knob to go from (low) 0.9 to (high) 0.099, then do this [expr (1 - $f1) * 0.8 + 0.099] and don’t use [i]
With problem 1, I think oweno is on to something, but I’m not familiar with pd latch, so I can’t say what it’s supposed to do.
I also created some helper patches, you might find the input output patch helpful so you can test on your computer. Organelle / PD Helper Files
Also, an unrelated question. Where do you find your puredata patches that you want to turn into organelle patches? I haven’t found many places where they exist.
As @iquestionshard mentioned in his topic on pd helper files, the best thing would be C&G equipping Organelle users with a bit more help to figure these patches out for themselves. I made an appeal for a video tutorial on adapting regular PD patches for use on the organelle, but nobody from C+G replied. I don’t know if that means it’s on the way, or that they knew they wouldn’t be able to deliver as they were very busy and didn’t want to say so. They must have a lot on their plate, i don’t know how big their team is - but I bought the Organelle on C+G’s word that PD is not difficult to write and configure for Organelle. It probably is easy compared to other programming languages in general, but i don’t have any knowledge of programming and I’m willing to bet pretty much every user of the device would appreciate there being more guidance out there so we can make these patches ourselves and light a spark under the hotbed of creative activity that should be happening on these forums. If it really is easy, somebody please show us once and never again!
Thanks for the tips, I’ll try those out! As for the original patch, I just Googled “Karplus-Strong” as I was specifically looking for that type of patch.
EDIT: Well, your decay solution worked! Thank you! Though I had to change the 8 to a 9 for it to get the full decay as per the original patch, so I changed it to this [expr (1 - $f1) * 0.9 + 0.099] and now that, along with the Width and Cutoff, all work together as they should (I updated the patch on Patchstorage accordingly.) Thank you again!
