Hi all,
Is there likely to be an update to Pure Data on the Organelle any time soon?.
PD has moved on so much from 0.49. Lots of really good externals missing including savestate, slop~ etc. Not to mention all of the offerings from third party libs such as Else.
As far as I know, there is no plan to move on from the current 0.49 version. I would like to say it would be cool to migrate to Plug-Data as it it makes it a lot less of an eye sore to look at lol
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I don’t see Pure Data as an eye sore, more vintage digital, also Plug Data is intensely buggy, at least on OsX. Any patch that has some complexity suffers inmensely. Oh well I’ll develop this processor for another platform, thank anyway
Plug data is more limited than pure data, more cpu intensive, less stable, We don’t know if it can run in --nogui mode. etc, etc.
But hey!, go on and try, I might be wrong about some of my statements…
Let us know…!
I have a solution and seems to be working. I have pisound and raspberry Pi 4b. Im running latest PD and Orac, all good, though somewhat roundabout to set up but managed to get it headless in the end. The processor I have been working on doesn;t have a GUI and relies on MIDI CC. Plug Data is young and will take sometime. Its a great effort and much appreciated, lets hope it matures into something stable. Hats off to all the endeavours involving Pure Data
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Hej!
@chrisk / @oweno / @thetechnobear
I assume that the best ‘update pd at your own risk procedure’ could be something like:
1 Run command to put sdcard in read/write mode:
mount -t ntfs-3g -o rw /dev/sda1 /media/sdcard ?
2 Update puredata:
sudo apt-get upgrade puredata. ?
3 Run command to put sdcard in read-only mode again ?
It could take me a while to figure out the correct terminal commands but it would be nice if We could get some brief instructions as a post in this Thread so people ‘from the future’ will be able to upgrade easily…
Until now I didn’t considered upgrading either but I discovered recently all the new File handling objects in Vanilla and I think they could be quite useful to browse samples/sequences/ etc from the display without having to use Shell (Which I will always love and use for other things…).
^^That’s one of my personal reasons to upgrade but for sure there are more…
Greetings
S
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typically running "apt-get install package " will install the updated package if it exists in the repos
This is the very thing that has turned me away from investing further in to C&G products. The Organelle was advertised as a way of creating music and audio using a progressive and well supported open source platform such as PD, which is updated regularly and still compatible with even computing hardware way older than the Organelles. Yet the woeful lack of updates to the Organelle’s core PD engine feels more like a limiting walled garden than a nod to open source.
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sounds possible but still you need to deal with the sdcard ‘read only’ situation, right? unless pd was installed in the usb drive or in the writable sd partition but I think it isn’t the case… If I don’t get answers here I might dare to try to update on my own…
If We get the terminal commands needed to update, I will be happy enough…
I understand also C&G not being in a hurry for updating as pd is being very usable, stable and efficient since many years so just the ‘developers’ Know what’s different and also We are the ones that should be able to figure out ourselves…
The Organelle OS is rather old and probably due for an update to the newest software releases. This will allow installing the newer version of Pd. Unfortunately this requires rebuilding the disk image which is still a manual process.
Until then, it is possible to install the newest Pd from source. I just did this successfully on an Organelle S. Note that installing it this way and bypassing the package manager is a bit of a hack and should be considered experimental. Make sure to back up anything important first. Or better yet, flash a new OS v4.2 on another SD card and use that.
First download code here
Move it onto the Organelle using scp or web interface. On the Organelle terminal, run the following commands.
Enable filesystem read/write, set date:
cd
sudo fw_dir/scripts/remount-rw.sh
sudo date -s '2024-04-30'
Move and extract pd:
mv /sdcard/pd-0.54-1.src.tar.gz /home/music/
tar xvzf pd-0.54-1.src.tar.gz
cd pd-0.54-1
Remove old pd:
sudo apt-get remove puredata
Build and install new Pd (takes a few minutes):
cd src/
make -f makefile.gnu
sudo make -f makefile.gnu prefix=/usr install
Probably best to restart, and it should be running Pd .54 now
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Great news to wake up to this morning. Thank you as this and will follow.
I have both Organelle original and M. What is the latest OS I should have running on both for doing this update? What I mean is, can the original run 4.2?
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Thanks a lot for this!
yeah, I haven’t thought that updating the OS was needed in order to ‘easily’ upgrade pd… I wonder if an OS update would bring any advantage (or trouble…)
Btw, Are you guys coming to Superbooth this year?
Greetings
S
Thanks for checking about OS version. No, the original Organelle (Organelle 1) cannot run the OS 4.2 for Organelle M & S. Please use OS 4.0 for Organelle 1 found here.
To update Organelle 1’s PD you should not run the sudo apt-get ... command as Organelle 1 does not use that package manager.
I wanna point out here that plugdata (https://plugdata.org)is getting incredibly solid at this point. 0.9 should be coming out soon, with the krewe prioritizing stability now that the features are so good.
I’m finding the stable builds quite stable, indeed.
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Plugdata is just a ‘fork’ of puredata with nice rounded corners and some other aesthetic features. As stated before… IT takes more memory, It uses more dependencies, probably uses more cpu, etc… I personally use it inside ableton live as vst (Mostly because I can’t use ‘real pd’.) but I will never consider it to run ‘headless’ in the organelle as the most efficient option is Miller’s original pd…
In my experience, with an old macbook pro (2012, i7 2.9ghz) I decided to move from vanilla to plugdata, cause it turns out to be much less expensive in terms of cpu usage. It’s true that it might be an specific issue related to the rendering of graphic objects, which on the organelle, that aspect would make no advantage at all. But at least I can say that you might not always get the better results with the latest version of vanilla, I had to stay on pd0.51-4, cause after that version the cpu usage started to get a lot more expensive. And being plugdata based on 0.54.1, and running to me much smoother than vanilla0.54.1, I didn’t have to think it that much.
And also it’s true that the last versions 0.9 plugdata is also much more solid than all the previous stable ones.
1- open both pd and plug data, go to terminal, launch top and see differences in cpu and specially memory…
2- see how much space both installers / binaries take
3- check your Library/application support/plugdata and see how many Gb’s of useless Junk you have piled up there. I just emptied up around 2 Gb today…
4- Plugdata can’t run headless. Thats the even more efficient way pd currently works in the organelle when you aren’t using VNC or connected to a monitor and seeing the editor.
5-Miller Puckette (Creator of Pd and Max…) Is still alive, working on pd and aware of plugdata…
Knowing Miller (a bit) . I have no doubt that if there is someone that could make pd more efficient, (Like When He made it to run in an esp32 microcontroller…) that’s Miller himself…
SO, yeah, keep using plugdata but keep in mind: No Vanilla = no plugdata
like I’ve said, on the organelle it wouldn’t be an advantage cause of the headless point.
1- I did run both, monitor activity or even xcode, and the cpu efficency with patchs with lots of gui objects is a lot better on plug data.
2- don’t care hou much space the installers takes, as long as the performance improves.
and, like I’ve also said, it was not a statement of each program in itself, but rather an apreciation of the efficency depending on the specs of the gear running it. Being as I say on my equipment in particular
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Dear Oweno. I have just updated my Organelle M succesfully and without a hitch. Thank you for providing very clear and precise instructions. Thanks to this update I can now deploy the following project for all Organelle users. It is completely Vanilla. It runs on all platforms that run Vanilla, iOs, Organelle and will be standalone on headless PI. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLq3MZ5erDgCQKnHX9RbtnL7GzgiFm9BvN